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Post by Twitter Cordova on May 29, 2009 1:07:50 GMT -5
I never look at it that way before. I read in one of the Dr. C/Susan fanfics from this one chapter where it explains that it would take 10 people to bathe Insectosaurus. So how could they possibly try to give a goo like B.O.B. a bath?  |
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Post by Mansion on May 29, 2009 1:13:34 GMT -5
Um, Link is NOT expendable. Maybe he can't fight a giant frickin' alien probe, but he can take out smaller enemies like the clones a lot better than Cockroach (who's next to useless in hand-to-hand) without the risk of getting distracted by B.O.B. He's good at fighting back hoards of minions, and that can come up a lot. Plus, yeah, any kind of aquatic problem, he's you fish-man.
And in the group dynamic, he's the gung-ho force of the team. When Susan was captured, who was the one who finally pulled them together to go rescue her? LINK. He's the face-any-challenge kind of guy. Susan's the heart, Cockroach is the brain, B.O.B.'s the lateral thinking, Insectra is the enforcer, and Link's the courage. All parts are nessacary.
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Post by fuzzynecromancer on May 29, 2009 2:13:56 GMT -5
But Link's fighting prowess only came up when Ginormica was human-sized. With a full-sized Ginormica, Link is combat-redundant. For every minion he takes out with an array of kung fu attacks, she'll take out three just by not watching where she walks.
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Post by Blackboxx on May 29, 2009 9:18:08 GMT -5
Um, Link is NOT expendable. Maybe he can't fight a giant frickin' alien probe, but he can take out smaller enemies like the clones a lot better than Cockroach (who's next to useless in hand-to-hand) without the risk of getting distracted by B.O.B. He's good at fighting back hoards of minions, and that can come up a lot. Plus, yeah, any kind of aquatic problem, he's you fish-man. And in the group dynamic, he's the gung-ho force of the team. When Susan was captured, who was the one who finally pulled them together to go rescue her? LINK. He's the face-any-challenge kind of guy. Susan's the heart, Cockroach is the brain, B.O.B.'s the lateral thinking, Insectra is the enforcer, and Link's the courage. All parts are nessacary. Good god, that is exactly what I think. He's the do-or-die type who always chooses "do" because it's one less letter. He's out of his prime but he's still incredibly lithe and agile. By being capable of thrashing hordes of normal sized foes alone, he frees Ginormica to take out the big threats (both in actual size and priority), ultimately saving the day. Of course, it's a team effort. They all save the day, this is just how Link does it. Sure, Ginormica could stomp everything, but then the bad guy can escape undisturbed. That's a temporary victory since the villain WILL come back eventually. Honestly, who else could fight a throng of creatures? BOB? He could cause some damage by eating them, but he clearly has limits as seen in the Golden Gate Bridge scene. Doc? Not a chance. He needs time to build stuff. Enemies aren't going to give him that time. Insecto is in the same boat as Ginormica. She fights the big stuff. |
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Post by Nobility on May 29, 2009 11:57:48 GMT -5
Another thing you'll have to remember as that the Monsters vs. Aliens franchise is more about comedy than anything else. Link is one of the main joke characters, where a good deal of the comedy is going to come from. There's no way they could consider him expendable for this very reason.
And I guarantee you they'll find some way to de-power Ginormica, for obvious reasons. Maybe invent some sort of kryptonite-like substance to counteract the quantonium, I dunno.
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Post by Mansion on May 29, 2009 13:23:53 GMT -5
Not to mention that we need someone to translate for Insectra!
But yes, Blackboxx extended the point I was making wonderfully, and Nobility is totally right about the comedy focus.
And the great thing about Link as a comedy character is that he does it all. Slapstick, dry wit, straightman AND funnyman. Ginormica is mostly a straightwoman to the other's wacky antics, as is Dr. Cockroach, except when his inventions backfire in a slapstick sort of way, and of course, B.O.B. is the quintessential brainless funnyman who misinterprets anything and does a lot of physical gags. But Link's the main sourse of sarcastic humor, and is sharp enough to understand everything that's going on while offering the counterpoints that no one else will make.
In terms of humor, actually, his jokes were consistently my favorites in the movie (as opposed to B.O.B.'s, which, while amusing, were formulatic).
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Post by fuzzynecromancer on May 29, 2009 15:32:42 GMT -5
I dunno. I actually think that straight-up comedic effect was one of the movies weaker points.
The thing that strikes me most about Monsters vs. Aliens is how much it works as an action movie. It's got good pacing, very emotionally satisfying scenes, and still manages to be character driven. Everything works towards a purpose, and let's be honest, it really looks cool.
I'm not sure these fast-paced, yet coherent action scenes would translate as well to the rigorous schedule, shorter production time, and lower budget of a television series. MvA thrives as a film, but the same things that make it look so great on in IMAX 3D can evaporate on the boob tube. The half-hour TV format could also easily constrict the character development, although I'll admit the MvA writing team seems adept at saving time by fusing characterization and plot advancement into one rapid stream.
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Post by Mansion on Jun 1, 2009 14:17:44 GMT -5
*poses lapsed thread with a stick*
New subject! (Now that we've all rushed forth to defend Link's honor and all.)
What are everyone's top antagonist wishes?
Mine are:
1. ZOMBIES! I love me some zombies. Hands down, my favorite brand of the undead. And the fight has EPIC written all over it. Hoards and hoards of the inexorable walking dead, unable to be crushed by sheer force! Also, I wanna see the MvA writers find an unconventional angle from which to deal with them. Unfortunately, this one's probably a pipe dream. You just don't get that many zombies in Nicktoons.
2. Femme fatale alien villainess. Besides being a great foil for Ginormica, what better cheesy sci-fi cliche to tackle? I mean, that's where the movie was origionally going to go, even! I wanna see this so bad.
3. Ghosts. OoooooOOOOoooohhhhHHHHHhhhhh... Ghosts. Another foe that can't be defeated with sheer force. Also, the camp potential could be epic. There are so many old cheesy ghost cliches and cartoons to draw from.
4. Some Godzilla-esque foes. As interesting as it would be to have a some foes that are unconventional... THERE HAS TO BE SOMETHING GIANT AND CLASSIC TO BASH. It's so satisfying in a deep, emotional way. Something that Insectra can go to town on. She didn't really get a chance to kick any ass in the movie. I would be okay with EsGarGantua actually showing up to fufill that need.
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Post by Nobility on Jun 1, 2009 16:41:15 GMT -5
Hm, ooh, oh dang...!
1. I second the cat-like femme fatale alien woman thingy. It's SO perfect.
2. Mummies. I want a mummy antagonist. Because mummies are awesome.
3. Mermaids/Siren. Some female monster that's all about charming sailors/men. But would it work on B.O.B...?
4. A Dr. Jekyl and Mr. Hyde type-character. C'mon, you know you want it!
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Post by Blackboxx on Jun 1, 2009 21:42:45 GMT -5
Zombies could work, but only if there's some mastermind behind them. In kiddie shows, they only serve to frighten the characters, and make the audience laugh. Just imagine hundreds of zombies closing in on the crew. No escape. Finally, the zombies reach their goal. Then... They don't know what to do because they've never actually caught anyone before. Most people are smart enough to run (or walk briskly). Of course, the mastermind (hey! a necromancer!) is stunned that his/her lovely army of the living dead is so incompetent.
I can just see Link smashing them to pieces, only to suddenly face a larger army of severed limbs and torsos. Anyone see Dead Alive (aka Braindead)? Of course, it wouldn't be nearly as bloody, but think the kung-fu priest scene (yes, it happpened).
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Post by Nobility on Jun 1, 2009 21:57:10 GMT -5
As fun as zombie plots are (and they HAVE been done in some kid's cartoons), I've always thought zombies were the wussiest of all monsters. I mean, they're slow as heck, stupid, and most of all, fragile- a well placed kick would split them in half. Yeah, sure, they might keep going, but if you knock away their jaw, they aren't going to have much to hurt you with (I suppose they could poke you to death). Of course, mummies aren't that much better in terms strength...
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Post by Mansion on Jun 3, 2009 22:25:52 GMT -5
...Then I'm afraid we will forever disagree, my friend.
(And yeah, sometimes you can get a decent zombie plots in a kid's show. The only two examples I can think of are Invader Zim and The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy, though, and those shows were off the charts to begin with...)
An individual zombie = weak. A hoard of several hundred = a force to be reckoned with. That's the point of zombies as a foe. It's not a mano-a-mano fight. It's a bunch of mindless masses that are just too numerous to overcome.
Also, there's the whole original DotD shambling zombie vs. the modern zombies of today with their increased strength and and fighting skills. Hmm. I could probably talk about this for... well, longer than I talk about shipping. For reals. I will fight for zombies to the death. (Ironic, no?)
But the point I was actually going for is one of humor over EPIC BATTLE OF MONSTERS VERSUS ZOMBIES. Like blackboxx was saying. Zombies can be a comical--but still dangerous!--foe. And considering the absolute saturation of the zombie horror genre (to the point that it quite often parodies itself), the sardonic potential could be epic and have multilevel humor.
Anyway... Mummies. Mummies are a different kettle of fish. They have curses and motivation and stuff. So while you could basically snap a mummy like a toothpick, you've still gotta reckon with some ancient Egyptian mojo. And, oh, how I want a mummy episode.
Also... I want sirens/mermaids/female monsters, too! If for absolutely nothing else than to see Link's reaction. The lols could be epic. But yeah, female monsters! Just not to the point of OCs (i.e. every werewolf, vampire, zombie, cyborg, animal hybrid, rouge scientist, and alien menace JUST SO HAPPENS to be a gorgeous female).
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Post by Blackboxx on Jun 4, 2009 9:23:02 GMT -5
How else are people going to write their fanfic of Doc falling for them? I doubt anyone's going to tread on the homosexual lines, so a male is out (not that it shouldn't ever be done, I just don't see fanfic writers doing that). By the way, that was yet another dig at shipping. I will lash myself 10 times in the closet for this later.
I'm not so sure that a whole bunch of female monsters would be bad. The movie makes generous use of role reversal. With males being the most common "superhero", I think it would actually be ok, provided it doesn't sink to the levels of stuff like Totally Spies. Just plain bad "girl power" fluff (the kind of show where their personality doesn't lend itself to the line or work they're in: hero stuff). Give them real purpose, drive, emotion, and personality, and I don't care if they just so happen to be a majority female.
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Post by Mansion on Jun 4, 2009 13:15:33 GMT -5
Okay, Arthur Dimmsdale, I'm sure you don't have to go that far. I was mocking Sues myself there.
What I was against was a huge slant either way towards male or female. Like, I wanna see female foes, but not to saturation point just for the hell of it. I agree with, well, yeah, everything you said.
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Post by Nobility on Jun 4, 2009 16:40:00 GMT -5
Blackboxx- I take it you don't like Totally Spies...?
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